Backups

Author	Comment
NastyNana	Backups		Lead	[-]
Posts: 235 10-Jul-08 11:57 PM	I know that there is alot of stuff going on right now.....lots of boards at a stand-still. But I think something is wrong here....at least at my board. Since we migrated in January, we have had daily backups. That was something I checked on daily....yea, alittle OCD about it but anyway...... I've been checking for the past week and my board has not been backed up since 6/30/08 and I thought I should bring it up. I don't know about anyone else's board or even how often anyone's board is supposed to be backed up. Thought I should bring it to someone's attention though. Thanks! Oops! Forgot board url......Nana's Nonsense
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Latarnia		#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 50 11-Jul-08 2:28 AM	I checked my board and, yes, the last backup was 6/30. How frequently are these backups suppose to take place? Also, wasn't Yuku promising from the get-go a feature that would enable administrators to back up their entire board? Where is this feature? Because it sure seems we need it, considering the problems that are occurring.
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exstreamuser		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 1243 11-Jul-08 3:04 AM	This is slightly worrying. I realize this may only be what is showing and that backups may well be in existance. Out of 17 boards, 15 were backed-up on the 30th and 2 on the 1st. The last backup was: 07/01/2008 04:58:50 on a cdb2 board.
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alison		#3	[url]	[-]
ADMINISTRATOR Posts: 9037 11-Jul-08 4:06 AM pink goddess	yes, I agree that's worrying. The bug could be that the backup system isn't recording the dates correctly, so I'll find out asap.
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lasher		#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 975 11-Jul-08 5:02 AM Check please!	Latarnia wrote: I checked my board and, yes, the last backup was 6/30. How frequently are these backups suppose to take place? Also, wasn't Yuku promising from the get-go a feature that would enable administrators to back up their entire board? Where is this feature? Because it sure seems we need it, considering the problems that are occurring. doubt that will ever happen. if you had your entire database backed up on your home pc...well then...you could take it and all your posts where ever you chose.
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Latarnia		#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 50 11-Jul-08 6:33 AM	So has the backup feature for board administrators been dropped? I mean, come on, this was one of the major forthcoming features promoted at the inception of Yuku.
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Jibril Ammon		#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2517 11-Jul-08 6:52 AM munificent member I felt so automated	Latarnia wrote: So has the backup feature for board administrators been dropped? I mean, come on, this was one of the major forthcoming features promoted at the inception of Yuku. At last I heard the logistics of admin back ups were difficult to do because of security. Though I think it would be good if we had a button we could push in the admin panel to back up the board on Yuku servers (a good thing to do before a major change in layout I would say... and for button pressing maniacs like myself who plays with the delete buttons too often), the ability to back up the boards on to our PCs wouldn't be practical. There is issues on sending down the user information that you would need to restore with.
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Latarnia		#7	[url]	[-]
Posts: 50 11-Jul-08 6:56 AM	Jibril Ammon wrote: Latarnia wrote: So has the backup feature for board administrators been dropped? I mean, come on, this was one of the major forthcoming features promoted at the inception of Yuku. At last I heard the logistics of admin back ups were difficult to do because of security. Though I think it would be good if we had a button we could push in the admin panel to back up the board on Yuku servers (a good thing to do before a major change in layout I would say... and for button pressing maniacs like myself who plays with the delete buttons too often), the ability to back up the boards on to our PCs wouldn't be practical. There is issues on sending down the user information that you would need to restore with. I would need a backup only to have access to posts/threads if they disappear. I wouldn't restore the entire board. I think all administrators would welcome such a feature. Just in case. Like the case we are seeing now, with boards reporting missing threads and posts. Again, this was one of the most talked about features being planned for Yuku. So was it just talk?
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Latarnia		#8	[url]	[-]
Posts: 50 11-Jul-08 7:03 AM	I found this doing a Google search. From Yuku, March 7, 2006, "board backup features directly available to admins" was promised as a feature, among others. And: "All of these features (and other ones) are in our development plan and will be available in the coming months."
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Jibril Ammon		#9	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2517 11-Jul-08 7:10 AM munificent member I felt so automated	No it wasn't just talk, they tried to work out how to do it and couldn't because the suggestion was allowing admins and owners to back up on their own computers. The user information couldn't be secured (as I understand from what we were told, I admit I don't completely understand the process, but I'm not security expert either). Whether board or just threads, it comes down to the posts. They couldn't find a way to make it so the user information was kept secure to allow personal backups. It was akin to allow board owners and admins access to the individual users account, meaning no security for the users on their own accounts. It may be different on other systems, but on Yuku, the user controls the accounts, not the board owners.
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TigerLady		#10	[url]	[-]
Posts: 614 11-Jul-08 7:35 AM	It seems that my board is behind all of the other yuku boards, as far as backups go: Last Backup: 06/29/2008 12:19:04 I'm not missing any posts yet, but if this epidemic spreads (which it seems it does) to my board, there's nothing to restore from. Last Edited By: TigerLady 11-Jul-08 7:37 AM. Edited 1 time.
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Latarnia		#11	[url]	[-]
Posts: 50 11-Jul-08 7:44 AM	I can save posts if I use a simple "save as" function. This doesn't compromise anyone's personal information. It would obviously be a tedious and long process to do this for an entire board, particularly one with many posts and members. Surely there has to be a way to save posts en masse without personal account information being gobbled up. And, if what you say is true about how "they tried to work out how to do it and couldn't," then it's rather unprofessional, I think, to hold something up as a promise to get people to join Yuku and then not deliver on that promise, particularly when the feature was one of the most important to ezBoard members who were very concerned about a repeat of the data loss of a couple of years ago. If the current Yuku problems of missing threads and posts is not resolved (ie, if those missing threads and posts do not come back), then we certainly are dealing, once again, with critical data loss. It really is unbelievable that this is happening, again.
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krispy76		#12	[url]	[-]
Posts: 242 11-Jul-08 8:33 AM	I never check mine. I'm stupid and assumed my board was being backed up. Just looked. Last Backup: 06/30/2008 07:52:44 Fabulous.
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Jibril Ammon		#13	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2517 11-Jul-08 8:37 AM munificent member I felt so automated	All right, fine. Then every promise, no matter how impossible it ends up to implement, has to be delivered. I really would love to live in that world, really. What matters is they tried, not that it was implemented. You are essentially asking your members to hand over their account information to you. If your members are fine with that, great, you've got a wonderfully trusting group of members. As I've tried to politely put it, they can't be saved en masse without the account information being saved on your computer... giving a security risk. Which brings us to another 'selling point' of Yuku, security. Which would you rather have, the ability to keep your board secure or the ability to back up posts on your own hard drive? You brought up the 05 hack after all, that was about security.... I'm happy to know that they are doing server side back ups. Logically that is the best way to do it. The system automatically backs up every night (in theory). As I stated before, it would be nice if we could back up server side at our own leisure if we wanted. Personal hard drive back ups seem impractical to me from an admin/owner standpoint. You're not going to do any better than an automatic back up unless you sat there and watched as everyone posted and backed up on to your system every minute of every hour of every day. It would be the only way to insure that you wouldn't loose a SINGLE post. How are you going to predict a problem? You log on one day to the servers eating posts... those posts are already gone. You aren't there continuously spending every waking hour backing up. You can't anticipate when something happens... no one has a crystal ball as to when a server is going to get a wild hare and do something crazy or (I hate to say it and hope it never happens again) someone hacks the system. You aren't getting a warning from hackers... it defeats their purpose. So we have a server side back up. Something happens, you request in a help ticket to restore from back up (yeah, it can be done, trust me). You're going to loose some posts on matter what, neither is a perfect solution, backing it up yourself is no better than Yuku backing it up automatically. Ezboard didn't back up, Yuku does, so something is better than nothing. This isn't a perfect world, so we have to take the best we are given... at least we have back ups, that's what we're given. As I said, no matter what you are going to loose posts and you can't predict when something is going happen. There's other board systems out there that allow you to back up on your hard drive, less secure systems, so if it's that important that you do your own hard drive back ups... there's other options for your board.
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paul4barbus		#14	[url]	[-]
Posts: 195 11-Jul-08 8:42 AM Lost my fishies	Didnt know it existed - I just found it 2 boards : Last Backup: 07/10/2008 20:14:17 - cdb6 Last Backup: 07/09/2008 20:20:39 - cdb7 paul4
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TigerLady		#15	[url]	[-]
Posts: 614 11-Jul-08 9:51 AM	Then every promise, no matter how impossible it ends up to implement, has to be delivered. Don't make promises you can't keep. Nobody is holding a gun to your head to force you to make impossible promises.
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Latarnia		#16	[url]	[-]
Posts: 50 11-Jul-08 10:04 AM	Jibril Ammon wrote: All right, fine. Then every promise, no matter how impossible it ends up to implement, has to be delivered. I really would love to live in that world, really. What matters is they tried, not that it was implemented. You are essentially asking your members to hand over their account information to you. If your members are fine with that, great, you've got a wonderfully trusting group of members. As I've tried to politely put it, they can't be saved en masse without the account information being saved on your computer... giving a security risk. Which brings us to another 'selling point' of Yuku, security. Which would you rather have, the ability to keep your board secure or the ability to back up posts on your own hard drive? You brought up the 05 hack after all, that was about security.... I'm happy to know that they are doing server side back ups. Logically that is the best way to do it. The system automatically backs up every night (in theory). As I stated before, it would be nice if we could back up server side at our own leisure if we wanted. Personal hard drive back ups seem impractical to me from an admin/owner standpoint. You're not going to do any better than an automatic back up unless you sat there and watched as everyone posted and backed up on to your system every minute of every hour of every day. It would be the only way to insure that you wouldn't loose a SINGLE post. How are you going to predict a problem? You log on one day to the servers eating posts... those posts are already gone. You aren't there continuously spending every waking hour backing up. You can't anticipate when something happens... no one has a crystal ball as to when a server is going to get a wild hare and do something crazy or (I hate to say it and hope it never happens again) someone hacks the system. You aren't getting a warning from hackers... it defeats their purpose. So we have a server side back up. Something happens, you request in a help ticket to restore from back up (yeah, it can be done, trust me). You're going to loose some posts on matter what, neither is a perfect solution, backing it up yourself is no better than Yuku backing it up automatically. Ezboard didn't back up, Yuku does, so something is better than nothing. This isn't a perfect world, so we have to take the best we are given... at least we have back ups, that's what we're given. As I said, no matter what you are going to loose posts and you can't predict when something is going happen. There's other board systems out there that allow you to back up on your hard drive, less secure systems, so if it's that important that you do your own hard drive back ups... there's other options for your board. Actually, ezBoard was supposed to have backups. And, sorry, but this is damn sloppy happening a second time from the ezBoard/Yuku organization. How are administrators and Yuku members supposed to feel about writing posts (sometimes lengthy ones) that could just disappear like that? Again, you didn't read my responses well, I think. I'm not asking for an administrator backup system that provides people's account information. I'm just asking for a backup system that gives me threads and posts, so I can be accountable for saving them, rather than solely Yuku, which appears has been negligent in this matter, unless those missing posts and threads appear again. (For which I will be grateful.) As for broken promises--again, I'm sorry, but if I'm spearheading a new board system and pronouncing that it will have admin backup, it becomes lame to come back months later and say, "We can't do it." If that was ever a possibility, then the promise should never have been made. It wasn't as if the promise was a qualification, either: "We will try to have admins get board backup." It was: "We will have this feature for you in the coming months." That seems pretty certain. Apparently, it wasn't at all. BTW, are we sure that work on this feature has been dropped? You're not part of staff, Jibril, nor, as far as I know, are you one of Yuku's "magicians," so I'd like to hear a confirmation of this from either staff or a magician. If work on this feature has been dropped, never to be revisited, then indeed I have to consider what options I and my board may have. Because at this point in time, I don't know how trusting I am that this Yuku system won't screw things up again--and next time it could get much worse.
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alison		#17	[url]	[-]
ADMINISTRATOR Posts: 9037 11-Jul-08 11:26 AM pink goddess	The script that updates your date of last backup is now being fixed. The backups ARE being done, just the date is not being updated. As for downloadable backups, while it was promised, and has not been scrapped altogether (as far as I know) it's not currently in the near future. There are many more core code changes to come, which could render older backups totally useless.
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alison		#18	[url]	[-]
ADMINISTRATOR Posts: 9037 11-Jul-08 12:15 PM pink goddess	btw, backups are done daily.
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NastyNana		#19	[url]	[-]
Posts: 235 11-Jul-08 1:06 PM	Yay! Thanks for looking into this so quickly Alison!
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FallenAngel		#20	[url]	[-]
Posts: 64 11-Jul-08 2:07 PM	So, how do you back up your entire board on your own pc??
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